We Need to Talk About Emmy #24: Christophe Nuyens on navigating the galaxy in 'Andor'
Cinematographer Christophe Nuyens joins us to discuss his work on 'Andor' Season 2, where he partnered with director Ariel Kleiman to expand the show's established visual language. Treating each episode block as a standalone film, Christophe reveals his character-driven approach to framing—finding angles that immerse audiences in the emotional weight of rebellion rather than relying on spectacle alone.
Our conversation touches on his international filmmaking experience and how working across Belgium, France, and the UK taught him to adapt his visual storytelling to different cultural approaches.
Transcript
You are listening to the we need to Talk About Asker podcast and this is our conversation with Christophe Nguyens, Emmy nominated cinematographer of Endor Season 2.
Speaker B:I think the nice thing about traveling while doing your job is that you learn culturally different ways of working from each bit.
Speaker B:You learn.
Speaker B:You pick your things you really like and you learn and you evolve, I think.
Speaker B:And that's really something I love because the day I have the feeling I'm not evolving anymore, that I want to quit.
Speaker A:Before we dive into the details of your work On Endor Season 2, I'm curious how you first connected or got connected with the project itself.
Speaker A:So how did this, as we know, massive Star wars universe find you?
Speaker A:Or maybe even vice versa?
Speaker B:Actually, it's because of David Mianti, a producer on the show.
Speaker B:I worked with him, he's French, he lives in the UK right now.
Speaker B:But I worked with him in France on a job and he was still a assistant director over there, a really good one.
Speaker B:And we had a really good connection on that job and we kept in touch and he moved to the uk, started producing and yeah, he introduced me to Sanne and Tony and from there on the ball started rolling, actually.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And coming into season two, you had the fairly rare opportunity in television, shooting six consecutive episodes and with the same director, Ariel Kleiman, and without the recaps and credits, if my numbers are somewhat correct, that's almost like four and a half hours of television.
Speaker A:And I'm sure we are talking about way, way more material than that.
Speaker A:What I'd like to ask you is do you, while working on it and maybe even after, do you see it or are you able to see it as a whole as if it was a film per se, or do you rather think of it as something that's so specifically divided into parts made into episodical?
Speaker B:I'm more or less like I did two films, actually.
Speaker B:I think for me and for us, each block felt like shooting a film because with the new concept of the season two, each block is a year, each three episodes is a year.
Speaker B:So we also approached it like that, to try to make every three episodes, treat it almost like as a film and give it its own identity.
Speaker B:And then the next block had a different identity and the same happened with the other directors and the ops following us.
Speaker B:So it was a really nice concept to work on.
Speaker B:And it's like you say it's really rare to do.
Speaker B:Normally you do the first one and the last one or something, but now it was one to six, which was really Nice.
Speaker B:It's really nice to.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:The first six episodes of a show.
Speaker A:Like Andor with that in mind, with Ariel, as the two of you were the lead director DP duo on this season.
Speaker A:But of course, on the first season, a visual language was established.
Speaker A:So how exactly did the two of you approach and come to honoring that established visual language?
Speaker B:Yeah, I think to start off with, we watched the whole first season and then we talked a lot about it.
Speaker B:And I think the first two weeks, the only thing we did was reading the scripts again and again and again and making notes and just spitting out.
Speaker B:It was also the first time I worked with Iel.
Speaker B:So it's also a good way to get each other to know and just to say, I like this in season one.
Speaker B:I like this in Rock one in general.
Speaker B:This is, for example, luckily, both of us said in general, we don't like coverage so much, so we should get a flow and a natural flow in the camera telling.
Speaker B:And we always try to avoid, for example, classical storytelling.
Speaker B:And what I mean with it is shot reverse shots.
Speaker B:Let's go tighter, longer lens.
Speaker B:We never did it.
Speaker B:So we always try to keep the camera moving, follow a character.
Speaker B:So I think we found each other quite well.
Speaker B:So it was really nice to work together.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And to further complicate things, there is this genre challenge you faced, which is, even though it's true for this aforementioned Star wars universe, the galaxy far, far away as a whole, but especially here, how it asks you to both shoot sci fi, epic space opera and the political thriller, because, yeah, we are not used to the two genres sharing the same visual language on this level.
Speaker A:So, technically, what did this mean for your work?
Speaker A:Are you switching between different visual philosophies within the same episode or stick to one within a block?
Speaker A:Walk me through it.
Speaker B:I think it's like I mentioned before, we treated it as movies, and I think the first three episodes were more the space opera, the.
Speaker B:The chase with the TIE fighter, everything happening on Yavin.
Speaker B:So it was more.
Speaker B:Yeah, the classical Star wars action bit.
Speaker B:And I think we treated it also like that.
Speaker B:And I think episode 4, 5, and 6 is more like a.
Speaker B:A thriller, a spy movie.
Speaker B:And we also chose our way to work with it.
Speaker B:For example, on those episodes, we used a lot of zoom lenses and longer lenses just to show that always someone was watching and you had to be careful.
Speaker B:And we tried to find techniques to tell the script that was in front of us.
Speaker B:And I think there's a huge difference in script.
Speaker B:I think in episode 1, 2, and 3, and 4, 5, and 6.
Speaker B:4, 5 and 6 was really setting up the Corman world and all the tension that was building up.
Speaker B:So, yeah, it was a different way of telling the story.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And there actually is something almost contradictory about needing to make the fantastical feel grounded to a point and the political feel epic to, once again, a point.
Speaker A:So I guess how did you navigate that paradox without letting one element overpower the other?
Speaker A:So it feels like one or maybe two cohesive stories rather than not only different, but separate things.
Speaker B:I think that the main thing we did in both blocks was always picking our character of the scene and trying to stick with it and trying to find the point of view of that character in the scene.
Speaker B:And I think the way we did it was, again, not by just classical coverage, but really having a wider lens and staying close with our character so you could feel everything was happening in his head and all the tension that was building up.
Speaker B:I think that's something we did over all the blocks, pick the characters in their moments.
Speaker B:There's also a lot of center framing and just putting those characters in the middle of the scene.
Speaker B:And I think that's a real.
Speaker B:I think, yeah, for us, it was important to really tell the story and the person's tied to it.
Speaker A:And not in any sort of provoking way, but.
Speaker A:Yeah, like, what's it like to as DP to take a step back and focus so much on the story when once again, working on a Star wars project that has so many incredible, crazy shots.
Speaker A:And then you, of course, at moments, have to concentrate on character development and following that part of the story.
Speaker B:Actually, I'm used to work like that because I see my job as telling a story, and making beautiful frames and images comes second for me.
Speaker B:I think.
Speaker B:Yeah, our main job is to tell a story, and sometimes you.
Speaker B:It's really nice to play with the camera in how telling a story, for example, filming someone from his back or from behind over here.
Speaker B:So you.
Speaker B:You also leave a little bit of his imagination for the viewer.
Speaker B:What is he feeling?
Speaker B:What is he thinking?
Speaker B:I think that's the thing I like the most about my job, is just a way of choosing a shot, lighting a scene, and playing with what it does to the story.
Speaker B:And I think that the.
Speaker B:Of course, making beautiful images is nice, but I think the most important thing is.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker B:And the thing that makes me most happy after the end of the shooting days.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:We shot a good scene, and a good scene, for me, is a scene where there was good acting, where.
Speaker B:Where everything came together.
Speaker B:Actually, if I have a day where I had some beautiful shots, but shots that didn't tell a lot and scenes that were not coherent.
Speaker B:Then I'm really grumpy.
Speaker B:And so for me, it's really important.
Speaker B:That's the thing I like the most about my job.
Speaker A:Does that mean that when you're reading a script and choosing a project, that feeling, it comes before seeing it?
Speaker B:Yeah, it's when I'm reading a script is my head already starts imagining.
Speaker B:It's like reading a book.
Speaker B:For me, if you read a book, you're creating your worlds and ideas.
Speaker B:For me, it works like that.
Speaker B:And the nice thing about the scripts of Andohis, they're so well written.
Speaker B:And also they're visually written also.
Speaker B:So if you read them, it's easy to see what to do with it, which is really nice.
Speaker B:It's a nice gift to work on a show like that with scripts like.
Speaker A:This, then to talk about your career in a more of a bigger picture sense.
Speaker A:I'd like to talk a little bit about the flow and progression of it.
Speaker A:Of course, coming from Belgium on Belgium productions to, for example, a Netflix production like Lupin, which is this massive French production.
Speaker A:But still, if I wanted to, I could say not too far from home and now to Andor.
Speaker A:But of course, with multiple projects in between.
Speaker A:And here we are, both of us not speaking our native languages yet.
Speaker A:Of course, cinema bridges these barriers.
Speaker A:So, yeah, in a general type of way.
Speaker A:How has this journey fed for you?
Speaker B:I think I finished film school at the perfect moment in Belgium.
Speaker B:I think I graduated at a moment that there were a lot of good directors coming off the R Film School and the other film schools in Belgium.
Speaker B:And there was also tax incentives in Belgium that were getting better.
Speaker B:So there was quite a bit of work.
Speaker B:And I started working with really good directors also.
Speaker B:Same age as me, just starting.
Speaker B:And I think being in that creative group helped me grow a lot.
Speaker B:And I think we grew together.
Speaker B:And then I think I did a show in Belgium, Cordon, which was quite successful, and that helped me and Tim Milan, the director, to go to the UK and do our first job in the uk.
Speaker B:And then from there I went to France to a job in Zon Blanche, Black Spot in English, I think.
Speaker B:And I won an award on Gamma.
Speaker B:And then from there on, I started working more in France.
Speaker B:And I always tried.
Speaker B:From.
Speaker B:From that moment, I always try to work to do a few projects in France and then a few in the uk because I think it's.
Speaker B:It's culturally, it's so different.
Speaker B:The way of working.
Speaker B:And I think it's really interesting.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:And I need boats, actually.
Speaker B:They both have their really nice things.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:I think.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Right now it's really.
Speaker B:I'm juggling a little bit in.
Speaker B:In between France and the uk.
Speaker A:And filmmaking is evolving all the time, especially nowadays with AI and everything.
Speaker A:But before also, there's been so many different ways and types of evolution.
Speaker A:But can you separate or pinpoint aspects of your filmmaking that could stay consistent across different scales?
Speaker A:Different productions made in different territories, and the ones that has had to evolve?
Speaker B:Well, I think it's more technical stuff that I'm used to.
Speaker B:It's like.
Speaker B:I love lenses.
Speaker B:So for each project, I go searching for the best lenses for the project.
Speaker B:And it's something I really love.
Speaker B:And in prep, I spend a lot of time on it, just searching for the good lens for the job.
Speaker B:And also I think I love working with LED lights on set because it gives you.
Speaker B:You almost.
Speaker B:It's almost like painting.
Speaker B:You can just adjust the color.
Speaker B:So precise and it works also fast.
Speaker B:So I think.
Speaker B:And then the.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think the way I approach a film, like I said, it's.
Speaker B:For me, it's just telling the story that's important.
Speaker B:But I think.
Speaker B:What else.
Speaker B:I also.
Speaker B:I think that's also the reason why I like jumping from France to the UK and just jumping around a little bit.
Speaker B:I worked also in Ukraine and in Kazakhstan and with local crews.
Speaker B:I think the nice thing about traveling while doing your job is that you learn culturally different ways of working from each bit you learn.
Speaker B:You pick your things you really like and you learn and you evolve, I think.
Speaker B:And that's really something I love, because the day I have the feeling I'm not evolving anymore, that I want to quit on each job, I need to have the feeling that I'm learning something.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And as we've talked about, and you once again mentioning going all over the world shooting different projects, there is, of course, something fascinating about how your camera can become this universal language and also a bridge between the film that's being made and the audience that will hopefully be watching it.
Speaker A:Is there a style, the language of your visual storytelling you're trying to maintain, or thanks to you, not solely, but mainly aiming to serve the story you're telling at the moment.
Speaker A:Is this something that's, of course, once again heavily affected by cultural contexts and everything that might come with production?
Speaker B:I think.
Speaker B:I think every DP has a little bit is style, but me for example, I really like to shoot on shorter lenses.
Speaker B:But I'm also.
Speaker B:Sometimes it scares me a bit because I want to evolve and sometimes I feel I need to get out of my comfort zone to try something different.
Speaker B:And that's also a good thing about working with different directors.
Speaker B:They can get you out of your comfort zone and it helps you to evolve.
Speaker B:Because I'm a little bit scared of having a style because then that means you're doing just the same thing.
Speaker B:Not just the same thing.
Speaker B:And I want to try to evolve and also try to do different things.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So it's always a constant two voices in your head that say, I, I. Yeah, this.
Speaker B:We should shoot on shorter, for example, shorter lenses.
Speaker B:No, maybe I should try longer lenses and maybe I should try something different this time.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:So it's.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:Yeah, but I think it's good that it keeps you on your toes.
Speaker A:Absolutely.
Speaker A:And finally the question that's always relevant, whether that be within your comfort zone or outside, what could be next for you?
Speaker B:For now, there's something lined up which I cannot talk about right now, but I think if.
Speaker B:Yeah, I would love to do a mix of feature films and nice TV shows.
Speaker B:Because also right now there's.
Speaker B:The distance between feature films and TV shows is almost.
Speaker B:Yeah, I think when I started there was always.
Speaker B:I started doing a lot of TV shows.
Speaker B:And in that time, if I does TV shows, he cannot shoot a movie.
Speaker B:Now I'm doing both a little bit.
Speaker B:Also because of.
Speaker B:Yeah, the quality of TV shows is almost surpassing feature films.
Speaker B:Look at Ender.
Speaker B:Yeah, and I'm not talking about my only my work.
Speaker B:I'm talking about the acting, production design, everything, Everything.
Speaker B:It's just.
Speaker B:It's totally different.
Speaker B:And yeah, I like to work on big TV shows, but sometimes I also like to work on smaller film projects just to.
Speaker B:Yeah, also to keep my.
Speaker B:Myself fresh and to keep on doing different things.
Speaker B:I think it's important.
Speaker A:100 and Christoph, once again, thank you so much for taking the time for this lovely chat.
Speaker A:And yeah, I'll be rooting for you, that's for sure.
Speaker B:Thank you very much and have a nice evening.
